Thursday, February 10, 2005

Religious Influence

by Mark West

What place should religion have in government operation? Should the two be totally divorced from one another or should the government merely be restricted from endorsing religious observance?

These questions face the 85th General Assembly of the Arkansas Congress. Representative Buddy Blair (D – Fort Smith) sponsored House Resolution 1005 that would eviscerate the influence of religion in our state government. The resolution, before it was changed, said that government should “operate independent of religious influence.” However, Representative Blair maintains that his bill is, “not anti-religion.”

(...cont in comments)


Blogger Mark West said...

(...cont)Representative Blair believes that government should be divorced of religious influence. One problem, such would require that any person desiring to seek office be of the “non-religious” variety for only those who are non-religious can honestly approach government with the influence of religion. His law would discriminate against the religious.

I’m sure that this bill is a response to the “religion”-oriented bills that received strong support in this session. However, doesn’t the United States Constitution already deal with this issue the establishment clause of its First Amendment? “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof.” We know what the establishment clause says, but what does it mean and how did we come up with the idea.

Scholars differ on the actual origination of the establishment clause, however many trace it to a religious origin (oops, religious influence is bad…right?). Most point to the Ten Commandments (another taboo) from the book of Exodus as the source from which such thought arrived. The first four commandments deal with how man relates to God and the remaining six deal with how man relates to man. It was believed that the government had no say in how man relates to God (i.e., the first four commandments) but was to develop a protective law for how man relates to man (i.e., the remaining six commandments). Thus the concept of the separation of church and state is derived from a religious influence. Oh the humanity!

So what does it mean? Government cannot tell people what forms of worship are right and wrong. Seems pretty simple…that is until folks want to promote religious ideas in government policy. Most liberals claim religious reasons for their efforts to use tax money to provide for the poor…yet want to claim that it is wrong for conservatives to claim religious reasons for their efforts to define marriage and ban abortion.

Truthfully, most Arkansans do not desire a government divorced of religious influence. Negative and positive impacts have resulted from religious influence in government. Religious influence both supported and opposed slavery, and women’s rights. The equality of man is a religious idea as well. Where does it all end?

Yet, to ask our leaders to be “non-religious” would be to ask them to be something they are not. Such a prohibition of individual rights is both unwarranted in our state and unconstitutional in our nation. Public policy shouldn’t prefer one religion over another, yet removing religious influence from public policy would eliminate the concept of morality from our public lives. What other source can we cling to as the moral base of our law other than from religion?

Representative Blair claims this law is not anti-religion, and I will give him the benefit of the doubt. Yet, I want to know what type of religious influence this law would prohibit? What is being targeted by this legislation? Until those questions are answered honestly, I am thankful that our legislature has stood in opposition to that phrase being in this bill. Religious influence cannot be prohibited from government so long as religious people are elected to run that government. Let’s stand with our legislature in recognizing that government cannot prohibit the free exercise of religion…even among its members.

5:28 PM, February 10, 2005  
Blogger Mark Moore (Moderator) said...

Mankind has already tried to form a government apart from religious influence- communism for example. Whatever its form, communist, facist, Baathist, etc.... all philosophies of government where the state is not subject to the mitigating power of faith wind up tyrannizing and oppressing their citizens. A state-based religion does the same. The state must be bound by the influence of the church, but not in league with it, else repression follows.

6:39 PM, February 10, 2005  
Blogger P. Manard said...



The phrase Separation of Church and State does not appear anywhere in the United States Constitution or the AR. State Constitution – but Was Written into the USSR Constitution

This Proposed Resolution (Declaration) Is Not An Accurate Representation Of:




Which reads as follows:

Article 52 [Religion]
(1) Citizens of the USSR are guaranteed freedom of conscience, that is, the right to profess or not to profess any religion, and to conduct religious worship or atheistic propaganda. Incitement of hostility or hatred on religious grounds is prohibited.

(2) In the USSR, the church is separated from the state, and the school from the church.”

USSR Constitution 1936

Please take note: This “Principle” (Syn. for belief; ideology; standard; attitude; law) as described here in this proposal is a treacherous one that only seeks to undermine our country and the very freedom the founding father’s of this country were aiming to protect.

IT COLLUDES WITH THE LIKES OF ACLU, COMMITTED in their campaign efforts to wipe out our Biblical Judeo-Christian foundations and heritage with all reference to it.

Atheist Secular Humanism is a Human Religion! – Missionary aim in U.S.A.:
ESTABLISH another “moral compass” (foundational source re: moral direction/standard for governing) and form of government through re-interpretation and invention, manipulation and such legislation as this.

< This interpretation of the United States Constitution is guilty of violating it. This strikes at the very heart and intent of it, which was meant to PROTECT NOT PREVENT the RECOGNITION of AND the INFLUENCE of the Biblical Judeo-Christian FAITH (Principle) and to uphold these very morals and principles as the standard and “guiding light” and “moral compass” so often referred to by the founders of this country and reaffirmed by the vast majority of those who followed. And still is by all those of us who still do look to this standard and seek to uphold it today.

This Resolution (Declaration) does not represent my support and I do not believe it rightly represents the people of Arkansas as a whole when they correctly understand what is being said here.

Lack of personal faith in God is one thing, trying to Establish Atheism as the Primary and Official Dogma & Belief system of this Government from which the Government and all those in this Government must be dictated by and thus be REQUIRED or obligated to follow when making or interpreting the constitutional laws of this state and/or country; saying they must act and do so in accordance to this Athiest/ Humanist ideology and principle as the primary Rule of Law (Principle) to be used TO Govern OVER THE PEOPLE


A Close look at:
By: Representative Blair


WHEREAS, the First Amendment of the United States Constitution states that “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof”; and

WHEREAS, Section 24 of Article 2 of the Arkansas Constitution grants all persons the right to worship Almighty God according to the dictates of their own consciences and prevents the government from preferring (?) one religious establishment or mode of worship over another; and
and, concurrently, that particular religious establishments, denominations, or modes of worship

<(religious establishment does not = foundational moral ideology, but refers to a formal organized human institution). As Article 2, Sec. 25 should clarify:
Religion, morality and knowledge being essential to good government, the General Assembly shall enact suitable laws to protect every religious denomination in the peaceable enjoyment of its own mode of public worship.

WHEREAS, the State of Arkansas (government) subscribes to (Endorses and Advances) the principle that government should (Must) operate independent of religious influence (apart from the influence of God and the people of faith) should not (is forbidden?) be endorsed or advanced (Subscribed to) by government (the Godless RULERS); ???

{Government fundamentally would then be established and forced to be obligated to act as an atheistic Supreme entity governing (ruling) the people and making laws from this (humanist) ideology/belief system and allegiance then!}


THAT the House of Representatives reaffirms its support of the principle of separation of church and state.

Changing America’s allegiance from in God we trust to Anti-God directed or dictated by??? who then? And based on whose values for the laws then?

{By Subscribing / Endorsing / Declaring that the Government will abide by the atheistic-Humanist creed as a mandate, is to essentially establish, insert into and apply the old Communist USSR constitutional Article 52, concerning their separation of church and state principle (rule of law),into the United States.}

Creating a USSA? And You Think This Is Constitutional?

• In response to a request that all reference to religion be removed from government, the House Judiciary Committee Report March 3, 1854 said:

"Had the people, during the Revolution, had any suspicion of any attempt to war against Christianity, the Revolution would have been strangled in the cradle. At the time of the adoption of the Constitution and the Amendments, the universal sentiment was that Christianity should be encouraged, not any one sect. In this age there can be no substitute for Christianity. That was the religion of the founders of the republic, and they expected it to remain the religion of their descendants. The great vital and conservative element in our system is the doctrines and divine truths of the gospel of Jesus Christ."

• John Quincy Adams, sixth president of the United States, said:

"The highest glory of the American Revolution was this: it connected, in one indissoluble bond, the principles of civil government with the principles of Christianity."

From Abraham Lincoln's "Proclamation Appointing a National Fast Day," March 30, 1863:

“Whereas, the Senate of the United States devoutly recognizing the Supreme Authority and just Government of Almighty God in all the affairs of men and of nations, has, by a resolution, requested the President to designate and set apart a day for national prayer and humiliation: And whereas, it is the duty of nations as well as of men to own their dependence upon the overruling power of God, to confess their sins and transgressions in humble sorrow yet with assured hope that genuine repentance will lead to mercy and pardon, and to recognize the sublime truth, announced in the Holy Scriptures and proven by all history: that those nations only are blessed whose God is the Lord: ….”

The freedom and liberty that this country was given and the founders ascribed to and spoke of was Primarily based upon the freedom described in Scriptures which is given by Almighty God our Creator and only fully realized through Christ Jesus.

The US Constitution and Bill of Rights can only be properly interpreted in the context of Biblical Judeo-Christian principles because it was the first and primary "guiding light" these men went by to form this government.

It is truly beautiful when considered in this proper and true context.

2Co 3:17 Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom.

Joh16:13 When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth, for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things that are to come.

Joh 16:14 He will glorify me, for he will take what is mine and declare it to you.

Psa 119:160 The sum of your word is truth, and every one of your righteous rules endures forever.

Joh 17:17 Sanctify them in the truth; your word is truth.

Regardless of what happens to America Jesus’ Declaration remains, “Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.” Mat 24:35

Gal 5:13-16 For you were called to freedom, brothers. Only do not use your freedom as an opportunity for the flesh, but through love serve one another. For the whole law is fulfilled in one word: "You shall love your neighbor as yourself." But if you bite and devour one another, watch out that you are not consumed by one another. But I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the flesh.

1Pe 2:16 Be free men, and yet do not make your freedom an excuse for base conduct, but be God's bondservants. (1912 Weymouth New Testament) 1Pe 2:16 Live as people who are free, not using your freedom as a cover-up for evil, but living as servants of God. (English Standard Version)

It was also intended by those who framed the U.S Constitution and the Bill of Rights to take the Biblical warnings about abusing our God given liberty to heart:

2Pe 2:1-3 But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will be false teachers (leaders) among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing upon themselves swift destruction. And many will follow their sensuality, and because of them the way of truth will be blasphemed. And in their greed they will exploit you with false words. Their condemnation from long ago is not idle, and their destruction is not asleep. They count it pleasure to revel in the daytime. They are blots and blemishes, reveling in their deceptions, while they feast with you……

2Pe 2:14-19 They have eyes full of adultery, insatiable for sin. They entice unsteady souls. They have hearts trained in greed. Accursed children! Forsaking the right way, they have gone astray. They have followed the way of Balaam, the son of Beor, who loved gain from wrongdoing, but was rebuked for his own transgression; a speechless donkey spoke with human voice and restrained the prophet's madness. These are waterless springs and mists driven by a storm. For them the gloom of utter darkness has been reserved. For, speaking loud boasts of folly, they entice by sensual passions of the flesh those who are barely escaping from those who live in error. They promise them freedom, but they themselves are slaves of corruption. For whatever overcomes a person, to that he is enslaved.

"It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great Nation was founded not by religionists, but by Christians; not on religions, but on the Gospel of Jesus Christ. For that reason alone, people of other faiths have been afforded freedom of worship here."

Patrick Henry 1776 wrote this (following the year of his speech where he said “give me liberty or give me death”):

"We recognize no Sovereign but God and no King but Jesus."

In this crucial hour of our nation’s history it is past time that the true saints of God give total allegiance to the Kingship of our Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ. The crisis of the ages demands that we renew the historic battle-cry of our Christian Forefathers –

"WE HAVE NO KING BUT KING JESUS!" and act like it.

How have we gotten so far away from God that now we've found
ourselves often so intimidated that many have become fearful to speak forthrightly about these truths-- Especially to name the Name of Jesus Christ as Lord or quote His Word in the public forum in a reverent way.It has nearly become forbidden in this land unless it is blasphemously used.

If the kind of ideology ACLU pushes keeps advancing we will no longer have the freedom that those who gave us the US Constitution and Bill of Rights meant to secure.

11:41 PM, February 13, 2005  
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