Thursday, September 14, 2006

Face It, Conservatives are the "RINOS" Now

A shocking reprot from William Greene, leader of the RightMarch PAC about how the Republican establishment is intervening in primaries to insure that the "moderate" (read "statist liberal") candidates win........


ALERT: I am angry. For the past few months, with your help, we've been working HARD on getting a liberal RINO (Republican In Name Only), Jim King, out of the Florida Senate, and replacing him with a REAL "Ronald Reagan" conservative Republican, Randall Terry.

It was a Republican primary, in a conservative district. All of our polling showed that the conservative candidate was ahead in the race, at least two-to-one. The voters in that district were obviously sick and tired of being represented by a FAKE Republican, and wanted a REAL one. And there wasn't even a Democrat running, so the winner of the primary would win the whole election.

We asked our members to volunteer time with a new web-based phone bank system, to call voters in the district to support our candidate. Our members gladly volunteered, all over the country.

We asked our members to donate to the campaign, and to our PAC, to help the "underdog" challenger take on this long-serving liberal incumbent. Our members dug deep and contributed to the cause and the campaign.

Our PAC ran "independent expenditure" radio ads, dropped direct mail, and made "robo-calls" to likely voters in the district, supporting the conservative candidate.

I sent my only employee (we run lean around here!) down to Florida with his family for two weeks, to campaign during early voting in the district. Then I went down with all of my own family during election week, to work the polls too.

We should have won. But we didn't.

Why not?

Because the Republican Party came into the primary... and pushed hard for the LIBERAL incumbent.

In the last two weeks of the campaign, the state GOP kicked in $400,000 to support the LIBERAL.

The Republican governor held a press conference and endorsed the LIBERAL.

And then a secretive special interest group, backed by trial lawyers and homosexual activists, ran nasty negative television ads full of lies every hour, on the hour, and dropped tens of thousands of negative direct mail letters to GOP voters -- to the tune of $250,000.

All in all, REPUBLICAN leaders spent over ONE MILLION DOLLARS to stop our "Reagan conservative" candidate from winning, and to re-elect one of the most corrupt LIBERAL GOP politicians in the country.

And they won.

I am angry.

Are you?

(continued- click THURDSDAY below and scroll down for rest of story, or if sent straight here just scroll down)

26 Comments:

Blogger Mark Moore (Moderator) said...

Many months ago, the RightMarch.com PAC endorsed Stephen Laffey for the U.S. Senate in Rhode Island. Laffey was a REAL Republican, running against the most liberal Republican in the Senate: Lincoln Chafee.

Lincoln Chafee is the RINO of RINOs -- he supports gay marriage and abortion; he opposes tax cuts and the war on terror; he even voted against Samuel Alito's nomination to the Supreme Court. This past week, Chafee personally scuttled an effort by fellow Republicans to confirm John Bolton as U.N. ambassador.

In the last presidential election, he announced that he didn't vote for George W. Bush... but wrote his father's name in. Say what?

So does the national GOP swoop in and do everything it can to support the conservative Laffey and knock Chafee out of the Senate?

No...

George W. Bush endorses LIBERAL Lincoln Chafee, and his wife comes into the state to campaign for him. The National Republican Senatorial Committee (NRSC) spends more than $1.2 million on advertisements attacking Mr. Laffey, saturating the television stations across the state. Karl Rove comes into Rhode Island to help Chafee's campaign. The Republican National Committee rolls out its 72-hour get-out-the-vote program -- used to great effect in 2002 and 2004 -- AGAINST Stephen Laffey. More than a dozen trained party turnout specialists encamped at a local motel to support Chafee's campaign.

They did everything they could to turn out DEMOCRAT-leaning independent voters, who were allowed to vote in the GOP primary this past Tuesday.

And they WON. Chafee won the primary.

WHAT IS WRONG WITH THESE PEOPLE?

I am angry. Are you?

These are the same "Party People" who did everything they could two years ago to make sure that Arlen Specter, another of the most liberal Republicans in the Senate, was re-elected over conservative "Reagan Republican" Pat Toomey -- in their opinion, they'd rather support a LIBERAL GOP incumbent than a TRUE GOP challenger. Thanks to them, we still have Specter waffling in the wind in the Senate, instead of a strong supporter of conservative values like Toomey.

These are also the same people that stabbed us in the back last week in Arizona, in a race where the RightMarch.com PAC has "maxed out" in the largest donations allowed under federal law.

Last week, the National Republican Congressional Committee (NRCC) declared war on YOU AND ME, violating its own rules and endorsing a RINO against a true-blue conservative candidate in one of the most critical and hotly contested primary campaigns in the nation.

This was the race between nationally-known Arizona Minuteman conservative Randy Graf, and his so-called "moderate" opponent, Steve Huffman.

Both are Republicans -- Randy Graf in heart and soul, Steve Huffman in name only. The NRCC backed a pro-abortion, pro-gay marriage, pro-illegal alien amnesty LIBERAL RINO, in the mold of retiring incumbent left-winger Jim Kolbe -- and LIED about it to rank-and-file Republicans by calling Huffman "conservative."

This Arizona Congressional race was so critical that it could literally be a turning point for good or for ill for border security, and conservative politics and policies, as well as the Republican Party coast-to-coast.

So what does the NRCC do? They inject $122,000 into the PRIMARY campaign -- which goes against their own rules -- to support the LIBERAL Republican candidate against the Reagan Conservative candidate. Thankfully, our candidate won this one -- but now the Republican Party won't support him!

I am angry. Are you?

In this week's GOP Senate primary in Delaware, our PAC endorsed another "Ronald Reagan conservative," Christine O'Donnell, in a three-way race -- with the winner facing vulnerable liberal Democrat incumbent Tom Carper in the fall. Once again, the GOP refused to endorse the *conservative* candidate.

Aside from immigration, O'Donnell's main opponent in the GOP primary, Jan Ting, did not take an authentic conservative stance on other issues. At a recent meeting, Ting indicated to a largely Democratic audience that he was in favor of pulling our troops out of Iraq. Ting may believe he is winning over some Democratic votes, but he is also alienating the Republican voter base that supports our President and our troops. On the other hand, Christine O'Donnell's position on social issues would attract socially conservative Democrats without alienating the GOP base. Christine has always stood strong on authentic Republican principles of limited government and fiscal accountability. This is what it would take to unseat Senator Carper this November.

The GOP supported the "moderate" Ting over O'Donnell -- and Ting won by less than 300 votes.

I AM ANGRY.

I hope you are, too.

Angry enough to finally DO SOMETHING about it.

TAKE ACTION: The fact is, the rank-and-file of the GOP are Ronald Reagan Republicans.

We are conservative pro-sovereignty patriots -- socially conservative, fiscally conservative, and conservative in our foreign policy -- and we take all three of those areas very seriously.

We are the active volunteer base of the party, the grassroots, the backbone of the party; we man the polling locations, we man the phone banks, we go door-to-door in our precincts, and we contribute financially to candidates and to the party organizations.

That is why the Republican Party nationally and at every state and local level needs our energy and wants our dedication.

But as important as we are to the survival and the success of the Republican Party at the local, state, and federal level -- the reality is this: the leftist Rockefeller Republicans reject the beliefs and the agenda of committed Ronald Reagan Republicans.

In fact, they LOATHE the idea of our principles firmly taking the helm of the Republican Party. They have been secretly and successfully betraying the principles of Ronald Reagan since the day President Reagan left office. That is why they tout left-wingers like Arnold Schwarzenegger and Rudy Giuliani as their new poster boys.

They want our votes, they want our money, they want our manpower when it comes to volunteering -- but they reject our deepest convictions. They do not want the animating force of our party to be the Judeo-Christian principles that guide us on social issues, the love of liberty that guides us on economic and foreign-policy issues, and the patriotic dedication to our Declaration and Constitution that guides us in our political judgments.

For the sake of winning elections, they will pay lip service to our most cherished beliefs -- in order to seduce us into helping them win elections. But once they have successfully played "fool the voter" and won the election -- they will quickly turn their backs on us and ignore our priorities and our public policy agenda. They will cut deals with the enemy -- deals that amount to treachery to our platform and betrayal of their campaign promises.

Therefore -
- Illegal aliens continue pouring over our borders by the MILLIONS taking jobs, benefits and citizens' rights ILLEGALLY, while Republicans control all three branches of the federal government, and GOP leaders wring their hands and deceitfully claim there is nothing they can do;
- Deficit spending spirals out of control, creating an unconscionable debt for our children and grandchildren -- all created by Republican majorities;
- Abortion continues to claim the lives of thousands of babies every day; the elderly, the infirm and the disabled are ever more vulnerable to the eugenicists; and technological violations of the human person proceed apace -- even though Republicans control the federal government;
- Militant homosexual extremists continue to redefine the traditional family and marriage, even though Republicans control most state governments;
- We have yet to truly implement school choice and school vouchers, even though Republicans tell us that school choice is their vision;
- Religious liberty remains under attack; the Ten Commandments continue to be removed from public buildings; when Judge Roy Moore was attacked and defamed, the Republicans in power turned their backs on him and stripped him of office;
- Tyrannical judges continue to usurp the authority of "We the People" yet our Republican majorities cower before them, and do not use the federal and state constitutional authority at their disposal to remove these despotic judges from power.

More could be said, but the situation is clear.

The simple truth is this: the Republican Party is at war with itself.

On one side, we have those of us who really believe in the truths of the Declaration of Independence, the laws of our Constitution, and the principles enunciated by and embodied in leaders of the GOP in the tradition of President Ronald Reagan.

On the other side we have those who pay lip service to the Republican Party Platform, but are secretly at war with the foundational principles of the Declaration of Independence, the Constitution, and the Reagan Revolution.

We are Republicans by conviction. That means that we believe that authentic Republican values are truer, and hence, better than the principles of the Democratic Party. But more than that, we believe that the principles of Republicanism enshrined in our Founding documents and institutions, and honored by the statesmanship of Abraham Lincoln, Teddy Roosevelt, Calvin Coolidge and Ronald Reagan, are not only better than those of the Democrat Party Platform -- but they are best for the continued vitality and integrity of our American Republic.

The vision of the Republican Party, as delineated by the Republican Party platform, respects the principle of human equality, and serves the cause of justice. We understand the vision of the Democratic Party to be fundamentally inequitable and unjust.

But at least when we face the Democrats on an open field of political battle we know exactly where they stand. They despise American nationalism and sovereignty; they are pro-abortion and proud of it; they are unashamedly pro-homosexual marriage; and they will never back down from the extremism of these positions. They are consistent and bold in their pursuit of socialism, injustice and iniquity.

But when we face our adversaries within the Republican Party, we are dealing with duplicity, deceit, and the treacherous; we are dealing with those who have entered our ranks wearing our colors, but are determined to weaken and if possible DESTROY our citadels of faith and conviction.

In that light -- the "Republicans" in our midst who reject Republican principles and values and who try to politically undermine and assassinate men like Randy Graf are far more dangerous than any 10 Democrats could ever be.

In that way, Republican turncoats -- or "RINOs" as they are popularly called -- in and out of the Republican Party apparatus, are far more unethical and dishonorable than our political adversaries in the Democratic Party.

And it is against those turncoat NRCC Republicans who launched a six-figure campaign for their "moderate" darling -- and against the local people's conservative favorite, Randy Graf -- that we ask you to mobilize NOW.

It is against the betrayal AGAIN by the NRSC Republicans who poured hundreds of thousands of dollars into Rhode Island to prop up the LIBERAL Lincoln Chafee against the CONSERVATIVE Stephen Laffey, that we ask you to mobilize NOW.

It is against the repeated REJECTION by President Bush and the national GOP of the requests by the grassroots to support REAL Republicans, who believe in solid CONSERVATIVE values, in favor of LIBERAL RINOs, that we ask you to mobilize NOW.

Will you join us in showing the NRCC, the NRSC, the GOP, and even President Bush just whose Grand Old Party gave America the Reagan Revolution?

We're SICK AND TIRED of Republican leaders inside the "beltway" in Washington, D.C., taking our money, using our volunteer efforts, and promising to support conservative policies and candidates, and then turning around and backing LIBERALS.

It's time to make these GOP leaders sit up and LISTEN to their grassroots base... and CHANGE what they're doing, where they're heading, and who they're supporting!

And we've got just the way to do that!

For about what it would cost you in time and telephone charges, you can send "Blast Faxes" DEMANDING that they stop backing liberal candidates and support conservatives instead. You can send personalized faxes NOW to President Bush, the national Republican party, the National Republican Senatorial Committee, and the National Republican Congressional Committee, and either ALL 55 GOP U.S. Senators for just $19; ALL 232 GOP U.S. Representatives for just $79; or ALL 287 GOP Representatives & Senators for just $95!

The leaders of the GOP need to hear from YOU!!! Let them know they are CUT OFF from your support because of their betrayal of the Reagan GOP Platform!

Send YOUR Blast Faxes Now: https://secure.responseenterprises.com/rinos/?a=7

NOTE: As always, you can also send a FREE message directly to your Senators and Congressmen, as well as President Bush and the GOP leaders -- just go to http://capwiz.com/sicminc/issues/alert/?alertid=9019551&type=TA to send your message now.

We are asking you to join us as we meet this challenge. Send YOUR Blast Faxes to the GOP leaders and elected officials, DEMANDING that they stop backing liberal candidates and support conservatives instead!

Send YOUR Blast Faxes Now: https://secure.responseenterprises.com/rinos/?a=7

Sincerely,


William Greene, President
RightMarch.com PAC

4:42 AM, September 14, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I'm a little confused about why you care about Republican Party politics. You make it sound almost as if you consider yourself a member of the party. I thought you folks had started your own party.

12:23 PM, September 14, 2006  
Blogger Mark Moore (Moderator) said...

I care because 1) I live in this country.

2) If the Republican party is going to claim to represent "conservatives" then they had better start doing it.

3:17 PM, September 14, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The Republicans don't claim to represent conservatives, that's just what Rush Limbaugh has got his audience believing.

3:24 PM, September 14, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Rush Limbaugh doesn't have his audience believing anything, except that Democrats are bad for the country, but that's true and he points that out everyday with numerous examples. For the most part, the Republican party is conservative, but there are those RINOs who might as well be Democrats, like Lincoln Chafee and John McCain.

3:31 PM, September 14, 2006  
Blogger Mark Moore (Moderator) said...

The Republicans themselves claim to represent conservatives, when it is convienient for them.

Now in their haste to force conservatives left I agree they are getting away from that. For example President Bush has been very open about his determination to force amnesty for illegal aliens down our throats- he just won't call it amnesty.

As for the other poster, please look at things objectively. Lincoln-Chaffee is not the RINO. You are. You are the one who believes things that your party does not support. When there is a candidate who believes like you do, the party takes sides in a primary to make sure they are defeated- even when there is no democratic opponent in the general election.

3:39 PM, September 14, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Last week, Katherine Harris overcame Republican Party harassment to secure the Republican nomination for U.S. Senate in Florida. But I don't expect the RINO's will now support the remainder of her campaign.

6:49 PM, September 14, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Lincoln-Chaffee is not the RINO. You are. You are the one who believes things that your party does not support"

I think this is incorrect.

The Republican Platform outlining the principles of the party is a conservative platform (pro life, limited government, etc).

The vast majority of people who consider themselves "Republicans" adhere to the principles that the party establishment claims to uphold.

Unfortunately, too many elected Republicans do not believe in those princples themselves. These are then the RINO's.

Let me compare the princples of the party to the princples in the bible (for discussion sake). Men too often do not uphold biblical princples, not even church going God fearing people. When people who are secular minded see Christians exhibiting unchristian like behavior sometimes they criticize the Christianity itself. And we defend it by saying that the principles of the religion are not the problem the corrupt men are.

Therefore, the principles of the party are not the problem. The RINO's not living up to the princples of the party are. The grassroots, thankfully, is getting stronger and stronger and over time I believe we will take control of the party from the liberal wing.

6:56 PM, September 14, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The vast majority of people who consider themselves "Republicans" adhere to the principles that the party establishment claims to uphold...

The RINO's not living up to the princples of the party are
[the problem].

Um, who is voting for these Liberal Republicans in the primaries? Who is voting these LR's into office? Is it not largely the Republican voters?

And then there's the (liberal) Republican leadership-- oh my!

The whole point of this article is that these LR's are not getting into office despite the party, they're getting into office with the party's help.

As far as their platform goes, maybe the Republicans need to auction it off on Ebay. So few use it anymore...

8:28 PM, September 14, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

My main point is this. The principles of the party are NOT the problem.

The Rino's are the ones that are NOT upholding the principles of the party. Those who do (i.e. the grass roots) are NOT the Rino's.

Some R voters do not stand up for the principles of the party as well. They are also rino's.

5:28 AM, September 15, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

You believe the party is defined by its platform. I say it's defined by the behavior of its candidates & officeholders. The platform is supposed to dictate the latter, but is utterly useless if it's not enforced.

7:45 AM, September 15, 2006  
Blogger Mark Moore (Moderator) said...

The platform is being used as the decoy to fool people into thinking that is what the party stands for. When people do the opposite of what they claim they want to do, I judge them by what they do, not what they say.

There is no enforcement mechanism in the party for holding candidates accountable to the platform. The leadership of the party actually goes out of its way to hurt candidates who adhere to the platfomr and shovels money to those who defy it.

Conclusion: the Republican Party Platform is a worthless scrap of paper. Its only value is its use in deluding conservative voters that they have a home in the GOP.

10:09 AM, September 15, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Many (if not most) of our freedoms "guaranteed" to us by the bill of rights have been diminished over the past couple of generations. Judges (and the acquiesence of both parties) have dminished: our religeous liberties, freedom of speech, gun rights, property rights, etc. (the list goes on).

Therefore, I could draw your conclusion and modify it accordingly:

Conclusion: the Constitution is a worthless scrap of paper. Its only value is its use in deluding Americans into thinking that they have guaranteed liberties.


But I wouldn't do that because I'm not a defeatist!!!!! I will not give up hope. I will continually fight within the bounds of the law and pray that this nation's liberties may be restored.


"The platform is being used as the decoy to fool people into thinking that is what the party stands for. When people do the opposite of what they claim they want to do, I judge them by what they do, not what they say."

I couldn't agree more. But the fact is that the base of the R party is solidly conservative. The base must be persuaded and trained (and blogs are a good tool for this) to solidify behind conservative candidates ONLY. Let the Rino's die on the vine. Let the national party die on the vine as well. Cut off all funding to the national party and its committees. The national party is only hurting itself for the long haul by behaving the way it is. The national party is committing suicide, it just doesn't know it yet. They may be feeling happy about sabotaging the conservative in RI but at the same time they're exposing themselves.

As for the enforcement mechansim, you're right. But if conservatives will come together and do what I said above, that will be all the enforcement that is required for the parties' politician to live up to the principles in the platform.

12:33 PM, September 15, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

We must have a constitution if we're going to have anything other than tyranny-- we don't have a choice. Therefore, regardless of how much our Constitution is ignored, we can do nothing else but seek its enforcement.

But we don't have to have the Republican Party, or any particular party for that matter. And if they get in the way of restoring our government or join forces with those who are trampling it underfoot, then it's time they are tossed out in favor of something that actully improves the situation.

4:29 PM, September 15, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

There is nothing wrong with our form of government. The Constitution "guarantees" freedoms for us. Yet our freedoms are trampled under foot of corrupt men.

Likewise there is nothing wrong with the principles of the R party other than the fact that the principles of the party are also trampled under foot of corrupt men.

You say "it's time they are tossed out in favor of something that actully improves the situation." Your focus seems to be the SYSTEM itself (by creating a party with better rules for discipline and so forth). The problem is not the SYSTEM. It is the people in the system.

A famous quote from a wise founder said something along the lines of "If men be good then government cannot be bad but if men be bad the government cannot be good."

What kind of party structure or system can be devised as to guarantee it will not be corrupted?

There is no such animal. Corrupt men can corrupt the best systems and will. They have in the R party but instead of handing them the keys conservatives everywhere should unite and take it back. HOw to do that is beyond the capacities of my brain but wise men joining together with God's help can accomplish anything, except designing a system (or a party) which is incorruptible, that is.

4:58 PM, September 15, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

You're not consistent. You say that "conservatives" shouldn't give up on the Republican Party, yet you preach about the futility of trying to improve any situation when the people are corrupt!

If you think the people are "corrupt", why are you even meddling in politics at all?

With regard to reforming the RP:
Well, it has also been said that it is easier for one man to pull another man down than it is for one man to pull another man up.

We both agree that corrupt and morally bankrupt people have infested both the RP and our government. But I have no choice than to take up the harder task of routing the bums out of our government, because the only other alternatives involve bloodshed. But, in most circumstances, it's much more efficient to start afresh than it is to reform a corrupt system.

Expending effort to reform your party is just about futile, and you will not have accomplished the goal by the time this nation has collapsed under the weight of the two-party trust.

5:38 PM, September 15, 2006  
Blogger Mark Moore (Moderator) said...

I think we all agree that the key is the character of the people running the system rather than they system itself, but the poster seems to be saying that the system is rigged to prevent the rise of the kind of men we need. They have to work their way up through the ranks of one of two parties that are themselves corrupt.

The two problems are one. Get a better system will stimulate the process of getting better men.

8:31 AM, September 16, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Yes, I do agree. Both the culture and the system are problematic at this point. We must consider improving both.

But if one wants to waste his time trying to reform the RP, I have no problem with that other than he is actually empowering the corrupt elements and denying we pioneers of his support.

At least, initially. I have no doubt that the vast majority will eventually join our cause.

8:46 AM, September 16, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"You're not consistent. You say that "conservatives" shouldn't give up on the Republican Party, yet you preach about the futility of trying to improve any situation when the people are corrupt!"

You misunderstand. Many of the politicians inhabiting Washington DC in the R party are not princpled. But the R base is largely made up of conservatives Christians who are principled. So the R party is RIPE to be taken over by the large conservative Christian base. HOw to make that happen is a broad topic. But to oversimplify things it would require a lot of money and a new organization that could take on the establishment (such as the RNC). But since the R base is RIPE to be persuaded not to support the party establishment it is possible with adequate resources.


The REAL problem is the sinful nature of mankind. Due to man's sinful nature they tend to always allow corruption to seep into the best designed systems and organizations.

If a new system is created it also can and very possibly will be corrupted over time (unless you can take away man's inherent sinful nature, which is impossible). If it were to be become corrupted would you try to stay in the fight and try to regain control or would you hand the keys to the party over and start all over again?

7:40 PM, September 16, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Apparently you're the one who believes a perfect system is attainable-- the one you currently have in the RP. You believe that it's so perfect, that even if it gets taken over by corrupt and selfish men, it's worth reforming.

My system, per the Founder's original design, opens the process up to competition. In that system, if a party ignores the will of its base, it dissolves into insignificance. It doesn't have to be reformed, it is automatically replaced by a party that will do what its members want.

Your system is stagnant. Over the 150 years the RP has been in existence, it has become thoroughly corrupted. You will one day admit that trying to reform it is a waste of time- all of you sincere conservatives eventually do. It's just a matter of getting all of you to admit it at the same time so we can restore the process back to the way the Framers had intended. What we now have is a hoax-- the illusion of choice, where a bunch of partisan hacks get to tell me which party I can vote for on election day.

8:48 PM, September 16, 2006  
Anonymous Mark Moore said...

Excellent point. Barriers to the establishment of new parties protect corruption. The higher the start-up costs of a new party, the easier it is for a corrupt party that does not serve the interests of its grass roots to maintain control.

Anything we do to make it easier for new parties to become competitive is therefore an act agaisnt corruption.

7:40 AM, September 17, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Apparently you're the one who believes a perfect system is attainable"

I absolutely do not believe it is attainable. Why? Because of man's propensity for sin. Therefore, the system you wish for will also be filled (if it comes to fruition) with men who have the same sinful inclinations. Therefore your plan of creating the perfect system to save the day is a flawed strategy, IMHO.

The SYSTEM is NOT the most important element in the delimma we face. It is the corruptness of humankind itself. No system will solve that problem.

A current example of the way in which I believe the RINO problem can be solved is going on in Ohio right now. The RINO R incumbent Mike Dewine is about 7 point behind in the polls. Why? Because Christian conservatives are not giving him their support as they have in the past. If R conservative voters can muster the fortitude to stand on princple and NOT vote for RINO's the current system will work itself out. Even in RI where the RINO R candidate won because of the establishment, there are enough conservatives (even in RI) to tilt the election to the D by not voting for the RINO in the general.

In order for this to occur nationwide a "rogue" element withing the GOP must rise and organize this effort and take on the establishment. It is happening in the D party right now with the moveon.orgs of the world and it can happen in the R party. Especially since the R party has so many Christian conservative voters to cultivate.

8:26 AM, September 17, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

If I'm being accused of having a fixation on a system, then so do YOU: a fixation on the Democrat's and Republican's corrupt racket.

I'm arguing for an IDEAL system-- not a perfect system. The ideal system, competition between political parties-- the Founder's system, keeps corrupt parties like the DP and RP from ignoring the voters, because, if they do, they are replaced the very next election cycle by their competitors. Obviously, the current system has no mechanism for purging corrupt parties and has enabled the same two parties to continue ruining this country for well over a century now. They accomplish this with the help of well-intentioned people like yourself.

Any success you have in reforming the Republican Party will be short-lived, as your party will inevitably be overwhelmed by corruption again in the future. You have no way of preventing that nor dealing with it when that time comes AGAIN. This is evident by your inability to purge it now:

You're people have been selling the RP reform con job since before Falwell's Moral Majority of the 70's. It's time to either change your tactic or be prepared for the same results you've been getting the last several decades.

But EVEN IF you managed to clean house in the RP, you are simply setting the next generations up for more of the same corruption we've been enduring, because you've made no changes to the elements of the system that have allowed the corruption to thrive so long in the first place.

As your president once made a mangled attempt at saying: "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me."

I'm not buying what you're selling.

12:49 PM, September 17, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

We both agree that the RINO problem exists. Agreed?

What is your solution? A new "Ideal System."

My solution: To purify the RP.

I'm not fixated on maintaining the current corrupt system which is why I want conservatives to overtake the RINO's. If we had three dominant parties, similarly, I wouldn't argue that if we increased to 5 (or more) we'd solve the problem. Why? I'll say it one more time - THE SYSTEM IS NOT THE PROBLEM OR THE SOLUTION TO THE PROBLEM.

I have tried to demonstrate this principle throughout the dialogue. Sinful mankind tend to corrupt the best of systems. As an example, I used Mark's words and logic in disregarding the R platform to similarly disregard the Constitution (which I assume you agree is a very good system of government, which has been corrupted) when I wrote:

"Conclusion: the Constitution is a worthless scrap of paper. Its only value is its use in deluding Americans into thinking that they have guaranteed liberties."

If the Constitution can be redeemed and restored, which I assume you believe, then so can the RP.

Following your logic of discarding what we have if it becomes corrupted, should we disregard the Constitution? If not why not?

5:09 PM, September 18, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

///"I'm not fixated on maintaining the current corrupt system which is why I want conservatives to overtake the RINO's."///

“Overtaking” the RINO’s is working within the same system, thus my accusation that you are fixated with the current system which hasn’t worked in over a century. Do you think that you're the first person to try reforming the RP? Furthermore, you propose NOTHING to prevent the corruption from reocurring. Please see my previous post.

///"Following your logic of discarding what we have if it becomes corrupted, should we disregard the Constitution? If not why not?"///

I've already answered your question:

We both agree that corrupt and morally bankrupt people have infested both the RP and our government. But I have no choice than to take up the harder task of routing the bums out of our government, because the only other alternatives involve bloodshed. But, in most circumstances, it's much more efficient to start afresh than it is to reform a corrupt system.

Expending effort to reform your party is just about futile, and you will not have accomplished the goal by the time this nation has collapsed under the weight of the two-party trust.

5:18 AM, September 19, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

A REAL conservative Republican would be someone like Barry Goldwater. Reagan's what you get when you sacrifice integrity for votes and forget where you came from.

5:46 AM, October 08, 2006  

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